Frank asked:
How long do you think the scent of the interdigital gland lasts after the hoof has been removed from the deer. I ask this because the last few training tracks I have done for my 5 month old Majestic hound consist of taking a deer leg on a stick and making a track and leaving the other deer leg at the end of the track. The pup has found the leg both times but there has not been any other deer tracks in the area. My next training session will be around allot of other deer tracks so would you want fresher legs than say a week old leg to compete with the live legs of the deer in the area. I hope your season is going well and thank you for your book it has really help me train my dog.
John replied:
I think that it makes a difference as to how you handle the deer hoof. I use a set of deer feet in tracking shoes over a month or more, on four or five different half mile tracks. In between tracks I store the tracking shoes, with hoofs attached, in a big plastic garbage bag in my chest freezer, and I suppose that this freezer storage helps to preserve the scent form the interdigital glands. The track itself is something that my dogs can follow after 24 hours. I imagine that a Majestic could do better than that.
On a track made with an aged deer hoof, we really don’t know whether the dog is following the scent of the interdigital gland, or just the smell of the rancid or rotting meat. There is much that we don’t know about what the dog actually perceives, but we do know that tracking shoes, or a deer foot on a stick, are good training devices.
Showing posts with label training tip. Show all posts
Showing posts with label training tip. Show all posts
Wednesday, November 18, 2009
Wednesday, September 17, 2008
Training tip #2
QUESTION:
Hallo John,
Can you please assist me in the following question, what is the reason when tracking wounded deer, while dog is on an leash, I am not underestimating your knowledge. I just want to know, because in the areas where I hunt a leash will complicate things, very busy and many trees. I use Jack Russel for this purpose. If my dog is on an leash it is unable to stop the wounded animal...but when it is not on leash it is capable of stopping the wounded animal and barking to let me know I must hurry up to the position of the wounded animal. Thanks for reading my letter. What are your suggestion to this matter of mine, because I am afraid my dog get killed by the wounded animal. Sorry for my poor English writing.
Enjoy your day
B. d. K., Kuruman, South Africa
ANSWER
In much of the United States the legal requirement is that the tracking dog remain on a leash at all times. In certain southern states of the USA and in Europe it is not legally required that the dog be worked on a leash.
Generally, all but thoroughly experienced dogs work better at the beginning on an old, cold line, if they are kept on the long tracking leash. It is easier to make sure that the dog is tracking the right animal, and it permits the handler to read the blood sign and determine how the animal is wounded. If the animal is still alive and takes off from the wound bed, then, in the European case, the dog is released from the leash to run down and bay the animal. This works well, but generally you need more than a single dog of Jack Russell size to bay a large animal.
The methods used in tracking are dependant on regulations and circumstances of your country. Releasing a dog puts him at risk of being hit by a car if roads are numerous. When properties are smaller than 1000s of hectares, there is a risk that the dog will get onto another property and be shot by the angry property owner or hunter. In the United States a small dog like a Russell is in danger of being killed by coyotes. I had a very good Russell killed by coyotes one night when I was raccoon hunting. My wirehaired dachshunds are never off lead at night.
If I lived in South Africa, I would probably modify the tracking methods I use in New York State of the USA.
John Jeanneney
Hallo John,
Can you please assist me in the following question, what is the reason when tracking wounded deer, while dog is on an leash, I am not underestimating your knowledge. I just want to know, because in the areas where I hunt a leash will complicate things, very busy and many trees. I use Jack Russel for this purpose. If my dog is on an leash it is unable to stop the wounded animal...but when it is not on leash it is capable of stopping the wounded animal and barking to let me know I must hurry up to the position of the wounded animal. Thanks for reading my letter. What are your suggestion to this matter of mine, because I am afraid my dog get killed by the wounded animal. Sorry for my poor English writing.
Enjoy your day
B. d. K., Kuruman, South Africa
ANSWER
In much of the United States the legal requirement is that the tracking dog remain on a leash at all times. In certain southern states of the USA and in Europe it is not legally required that the dog be worked on a leash.
Generally, all but thoroughly experienced dogs work better at the beginning on an old, cold line, if they are kept on the long tracking leash. It is easier to make sure that the dog is tracking the right animal, and it permits the handler to read the blood sign and determine how the animal is wounded. If the animal is still alive and takes off from the wound bed, then, in the European case, the dog is released from the leash to run down and bay the animal. This works well, but generally you need more than a single dog of Jack Russell size to bay a large animal.
The methods used in tracking are dependant on regulations and circumstances of your country. Releasing a dog puts him at risk of being hit by a car if roads are numerous. When properties are smaller than 1000s of hectares, there is a risk that the dog will get onto another property and be shot by the angry property owner or hunter. In the United States a small dog like a Russell is in danger of being killed by coyotes. I had a very good Russell killed by coyotes one night when I was raccoon hunting. My wirehaired dachshunds are never off lead at night.
If I lived in South Africa, I would probably modify the tracking methods I use in New York State of the USA.
John Jeanneney
Monday, September 8, 2008
Training tip #1
QUESTION FROM GARY IN UK:
Hello John
I would be very grateful if you could read through this email and give me some advice on getting my 4 month old Labrador to stick to a trail. This is not my first dog, I have bought him to replace my 11 yr old Labrador. My old Lab really taught himself on finding wounded deer, but I would like to put a lot of effort into this pup to find them really hard deer my old Lab would fail on.
I bought the pup at 8 weeks old from deerstalking line that goes back generations. Most of this line of dogs have picked up tracking by themselves as there are still not that many people laying blood trails and putting the time and effort into it.
About the pup
Does try to be top dog with the older dogs by hanging off their ears and hanging off their necks. Doesn't seem to be scared of new things or loud noises. Easily upset if you raise your voice to him. Likes to search for small biscuits in long grass and doesn't give in easily.
Training
Since I have been training the weather as been mostly sunny spells,rain showers and wind. I never lay more than 1 trail per week. Started with liver drags on grass, which he followed but in a S shaped weave he never seemed to go in a line.Bits of liver were left at the end of the trail.
I then purchased a set of sent shoes.Roe deer feet were used as I thought this might encourage him to hold the line better,it didn't. Then I used a Red Stag feet.
He gets very excited when I get the tracking lead and collar out,and shakes the deer skin at the end of the trail and carries it around very excitedly.
Conclusion
He just will not stick to the track and is now starting to lift his head to look for the skin. I need to almost lead him all the way along the track encouraging him to keep his nose down.
I feel that he is now relying on me to show him the track. The tracks are no more than 100 yds long and have been laid on grass,stubble and in woodland. There have been no distractions such as cattle or live stock.
When he weaves along a track it looks as tough he is keen and on the track but he is the wrong side of it if there is a cross wind.Then sometimes he just heads off in the wrong direction but with his nose down.
Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
ANSWER FROM JOHN:
Not all four month-old pups are not tracking well at that early age, and of course there are some that never develop good tracking skills. There are always some pups without good tracking aptitude, despite the fact that they have an impressive pedigree of trackers behind them. I have produced some of these myself.
Here are some things that you can try:
Work your pup on older blood trails, six or twelve hours. He has the nose to handle this. The problem is his still-immature brain that must process the information his nose brings in. Often, bored, uninterested dogs that do sloppy tracking work will do better when they are challenged by a more difficult line. I suggest this to people, and time after time they call back to say that the short, but more difficult line really improved their dog’s performance.
Another thing that often works is “baiting” the line. I like to put a piece of cheese or a scrap of meat, such as a hotdog chunk, in an old, pre-digital era film canister. Small prescription medicine vials will also work. The container keeps the ants, flies and vermin off the bait. I put blood on these little canisters and place them along the line, especially after turns. When your pup “finds” one, you congratulate him and open it for him to that he can have the treat. This helps instill the idea of dog /handler cooperation. Once he gets the idea of what it is all about, he will realize that he has to stay on the line to gets the rewards.
You can use the same method with scent shoes, but generally I do not work with scent shoes until a pup is confidently working lines at least 400 meters long.
Your dog seems to be very responsive, which is characteristic of Labs and a very good sign that he will try to please you. Give him lots of praise when he is on the line. If he gets off, I like to ask the pup, “Is that right?” with a strong questioning tone in my voice. Usually he will turn, give me a funny look and come back to the line.
I hope this helps. Please get back to me and let me know about how he progresses.
John Jeanneney
Hello John
I would be very grateful if you could read through this email and give me some advice on getting my 4 month old Labrador to stick to a trail. This is not my first dog, I have bought him to replace my 11 yr old Labrador. My old Lab really taught himself on finding wounded deer, but I would like to put a lot of effort into this pup to find them really hard deer my old Lab would fail on.
I bought the pup at 8 weeks old from deerstalking line that goes back generations. Most of this line of dogs have picked up tracking by themselves as there are still not that many people laying blood trails and putting the time and effort into it.
About the pup
Does try to be top dog with the older dogs by hanging off their ears and hanging off their necks. Doesn't seem to be scared of new things or loud noises. Easily upset if you raise your voice to him. Likes to search for small biscuits in long grass and doesn't give in easily.
Training
Since I have been training the weather as been mostly sunny spells,rain showers and wind. I never lay more than 1 trail per week. Started with liver drags on grass, which he followed but in a S shaped weave he never seemed to go in a line.Bits of liver were left at the end of the trail.
I then purchased a set of sent shoes.Roe deer feet were used as I thought this might encourage him to hold the line better,it didn't. Then I used a Red Stag feet.
He gets very excited when I get the tracking lead and collar out,and shakes the deer skin at the end of the trail and carries it around very excitedly.
Conclusion
He just will not stick to the track and is now starting to lift his head to look for the skin. I need to almost lead him all the way along the track encouraging him to keep his nose down.
I feel that he is now relying on me to show him the track. The tracks are no more than 100 yds long and have been laid on grass,stubble and in woodland. There have been no distractions such as cattle or live stock.
When he weaves along a track it looks as tough he is keen and on the track but he is the wrong side of it if there is a cross wind.Then sometimes he just heads off in the wrong direction but with his nose down.
Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
ANSWER FROM JOHN:
Not all four month-old pups are not tracking well at that early age, and of course there are some that never develop good tracking skills. There are always some pups without good tracking aptitude, despite the fact that they have an impressive pedigree of trackers behind them. I have produced some of these myself.
Here are some things that you can try:
Work your pup on older blood trails, six or twelve hours. He has the nose to handle this. The problem is his still-immature brain that must process the information his nose brings in. Often, bored, uninterested dogs that do sloppy tracking work will do better when they are challenged by a more difficult line. I suggest this to people, and time after time they call back to say that the short, but more difficult line really improved their dog’s performance.
Another thing that often works is “baiting” the line. I like to put a piece of cheese or a scrap of meat, such as a hotdog chunk, in an old, pre-digital era film canister. Small prescription medicine vials will also work. The container keeps the ants, flies and vermin off the bait. I put blood on these little canisters and place them along the line, especially after turns. When your pup “finds” one, you congratulate him and open it for him to that he can have the treat. This helps instill the idea of dog /handler cooperation. Once he gets the idea of what it is all about, he will realize that he has to stay on the line to gets the rewards.
You can use the same method with scent shoes, but generally I do not work with scent shoes until a pup is confidently working lines at least 400 meters long.
Your dog seems to be very responsive, which is characteristic of Labs and a very good sign that he will try to please you. Give him lots of praise when he is on the line. If he gets off, I like to ask the pup, “Is that right?” with a strong questioning tone in my voice. Usually he will turn, give me a funny look and come back to the line.
I hope this helps. Please get back to me and let me know about how he progresses.
John Jeanneney
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